Can we talk about AQ40 idols...

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Schwing
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Can we talk about AQ40 idols...

Postby Schwing » Fri Sep 02, 2016 4:57 am

OK so I have no evidence to back this up, purely anecdotal experience hence it's in the raids forum not the bug forum.

AQ40 idol drop rates seem way off, whilst back in retail vanilla people sometimes had to wait a week or two to cash in tokens it was nothing like the 6 week plus (and getting longer each week) queues we currently have on this server. we had a pretty close knit server back in the day and it wasn't just my guild, never heard reports of the sort of backlog we're seeing from others either...if it was the case the forums would have exploded.

As an aside regalia/armaments drops also seem kind of low, maybe my guild were just lucky over a sustained period of time but we were disappointed if we had a run with no drops because we normally had at least one, sometimes 2 on each run.

Sure we can look at drop rates on the various databases but those seem sketchy at best.

Would be interested in other people's thoughts?
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Zaakir
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Re: Can we talk about AQ40 idols...

Postby Zaakir » Fri Sep 02, 2016 6:03 am

One possible issue is that we've been getting the gear tokens from day 1, my guess is that in retail guilds weren't acquiring tokens quite as fast as we are, they would build up a bit of a reserve of idols or at least keys rather than having new people getting tokens every single raid. A bit of a guess on my part, I don't know for sure.

Droprate info for the keys https://web.archive.org/web/20060302074 ... item=21762

Quick estimation of the occurrence of these mobs in AQ:

6 defender
3 Warder
6 Nullifier
12 Mindslayer
5 Champion
8 Sentinel
3 Brainwasher
3 Eradicator
12 Slayer
10 Lasher

For 68 total. A bit of a guesstimate going off aowow and memory.

68 * .07 = 4.75, then 4-5 keys per run is expected for the chests? But from my looting I don't feel like we've been short on keys..
Last edited by Zaakir on Wed Sep 21, 2016 6:02 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Schwing
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Re: Can we talk about AQ40 idols...

Postby Schwing » Sun Sep 04, 2016 5:21 pm

Whilst that's the case for hest other guilds (ally side at least) like DO, Victimized, DiL are/were all suffering from the same problems yet are progressing at a rate much more in line with decent quality vanilla guilds back on retail.

As an example I got the first tokens in Victimized yet never got more than 1 idol required for either over the course of a number of raids. You can account in bad luck but the simple fact is the waiting lists are just getting longer and will continue to do so. That's not sustainable.
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Zaakir
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Re: Can we talk about AQ40 idols...

Postby Zaakir » Sun Sep 04, 2016 10:22 pm

I see.

So we should try to figure out what is going on: are we getting fewer keys; are we getting fewer idol drops; or fewer idols in chests than we should be.
Moordots2
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Re: Can we talk about AQ40 idols...

Postby Moordots2 » Fri Sep 09, 2016 7:02 am

TLDR, I searched this thread for Idols of the Sun, but found none. Therefore, I say, <Idol of the Sun>; carry on =D.
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Manatee
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Re: Can we talk about AQ40 idols...

Postby Manatee » Fri Sep 09, 2016 1:40 pm

Given the way the data collecting addons worked back in the day, I'd say the coffer drops are very likely to be accurate. Anyone opening one would have seen all the loot because they were the ones to unlock it.

Most people looting a corpse on the other hand wouldn't see a key because the first person to loot would usually grab it.

Essentially, if any changes are to be made, they should be to the key drop rate.
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Atreyu
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Re: Can we talk about AQ40 idols...

Postby Atreyu » Tue Sep 13, 2016 11:21 pm

bump. Idol droprate seems real real low, even in AQ20, opened 6 coffers today, got 1 idol. Entire raid we got 3 I beiieve including the 1 from the coffers. We didn't do ayamiss because of time. This ultra low droprate seems to be the norm for our runs, in vanilla AQ20/40 I never remember idols being much of a problem at all to come by
Schwing
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Re: Can we talk about AQ40 idols...

Postby Schwing » Mon Sep 19, 2016 5:13 am

No thoughts on this from the GMs/Devs at all?

As it stands our backlog looks something like this (dating back to mid July):

Idols of Night: 30
Idols of Sun: 20
Idols of War: 8
Idols of Death: 14
Idols of Strife: 2
Idols of Sage: 8
Idols of Life: 6
Idols of Rebirth: 6

You can't tell me there's not something wrong with that picture?

As a population we have our moments, we're not always the most understanding but we're not a patch on the type that are active on retail forums. There is no way back in the day a 3 month+ waiting list for the supposedly easy part of a tier set would have flown without outright riots...and that simply wasn't the case back in retail.
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Moffitt
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Re: Can we talk about AQ40 idols...

Postby Moffitt » Mon Sep 19, 2016 6:51 am

We of course have thoughts on this, and are looking at the droprate. Thus far, this is less a <bug report with lots of evidence> and more a <I think something is wrong, but don't have evidence> kind of post where we don't have much to go on. The Greater Scarab Coffer Key droprate appears to be accurate, based on the link above. Is the issue then that too few idols are dropping from mobs? Are too few appearing in the Coffers?

It is not ignored but involves some searching and potentially a number of updates/corrections to the loottable (which is time consuming). I plan to look into these droprates this week, I hope, in any case.
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Kainnee
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Re: Can we talk about AQ40 idols...

Postby Kainnee » Mon Sep 19, 2016 11:31 am

Anecdotal:

When we entered AQ40 on retail my raid was in the middle of a restructuring process. We had a raid alliance back in the day and one of our guilds decided to stand on their own feet so we had a less than ideal setup when we started progressing through AQ. This means we wiped a lot and had to kill a lot of respawning trash in the process, getting us a decent amount of keys and idols. I can't remember anybody ever being on a waitlist for AQ idols, it just didn't happen. By the time we switched from AQ to naxx our bank was full with idols and scarabs.

Droprate on Rebirth seems awfully low and it doesn't look like it's getting better. The waitlist will just continue growing.
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